2 Men In Black and White: An Honest Conversation

MARK HAYES (00:01.774)
Alright ladies and gentlemen, welcome back. Another exciting edition of Two Minute Black and White, an honest conversation. I'm going to tell you what, the backlash is real, ladies and gentlemen. I got the camouflage on today because we are in a battle in the black community. That's right. Well, I wouldn't really call it a battle. It's mostly a skirmish because we know the numbers when it comes to who supports Donald Trump and who don't.

I got an issue with the people supporting Donald Trump. Yes, I do. I got an issue with Chile. I got an issue with Nick Cannon not knowing the proper context of history. I got an issue with Snoop Dogg, not just because he kidnapped me in Rochester. Yeah, 1993. We'll get into that story a little later on another episode.

I'm still pissed about that and shook nights in jail now, so he can't do shit to me. Fuck you shook Anyway, I didn't say that to his face Brock and Ellis is with me From the beautiful confines of the upper Hudson River Valley Brock. Let's get right into it, bro the backlash For Chile is hitting hard harder. I would say then Nick Cannon Nick Cannon just Came off as plainly stupid with his comments

But Chile, you know, I think people are more upset with Chile because she left it out there, right? Tia, T-Baz told us a while ago that her group member voted for Donald Trump, but nobody really listened. It was kind of, you know, kind of brushed off, but we knew what was going on. So if you're Black Maga, that means you're subscribing to all the Doji cuts.

to the 300,000 African-American women who lost their jobs in the American government, those federal jobs, those pension paid jobs with health benefits, supporting numerous families all over this country, predominantly though in the DMV, right? Also known as Chocolate City, Washington, DC. Lot of federal employees.

MARK HAYES (02:22.718)
African Americans that work for the federal government in that area and again throughout the country, especially in the larger cities. So Brock, you know, my issue is that these people supporting Donald Trump are in it for themselves and they're not thinking about the collective. And that's what's changed from April 4th, 1968.

to April 4th, 2026.

And you know what April 4th is.

Brock Ganeles (02:54.942)
Mark, I got this.

What's April 4?

MARK HAYES (03:00.002)
The assassination of Dr. Martin Luther King Jr.

Brock Ganeles (03:03.737)
it's today? anniversary of that? Wow, I should have that. Okay. So I should have known that. Now, these skirmishes going on in the black community are tangentially touching the white silos. Barely, right? The Nicki Minaj outbursts

MARK HAYES (03:04.92)
Today, today's the anniversary.

MARK HAYES (03:24.099)
Barely.

Brock Ganeles (03:28.735)
kind of crossed over more than some others, cause she's a little more famous than Nick Cannon or Chili. Nick Cannon's on a lot of TV. But maybe, you know, who's to say? So we've been really siloed.

MARK HAYES (03:38.572)
Well, I don't know! Maybe today!

Yeah. Yeah.

Brock Ganeles (03:50.527)
We've talked about it, right? White people are out marching every couple of months in what are now being called meetups by the black community. I've been calling them polite parades, know, you know, kind of hand wringing and writing strongly worded letters and, and waiting for those midterms so we can get out there and vote and peaceably change things in America, quote, back to the way they were. So that's where white America is.

MARK HAYES (03:59.49)
Yeah.

MARK HAYES (04:14.806)
Right.

Brock Ganeles (04:17.822)
right? Not angry enough, not getting shit done, getting steamrolled by Trump while he steals all the money and totally destroys America on the world stage. But in the black community, from what I've seen on the limited tidbits I get in my feed has been totally, well, first of all, I know they've been totally sitting out the protest because I've been there and seen Nary, a person of color and

MARK HAYES (04:39.478)
Right. Right.

Brock Ganeles (04:45.108)
They've been kind of calling the white people's effort somewhat useless thus far in terms of confronting Donald Trump.

MARK HAYES (04:54.638)
I wouldn't say it's useless. I'd say ineffective. Yeah, I'd say ineffective and ineffective because black in black people's minds, we don't know if white people willing to go far enough to do what is actually required at these protests. Right? We we okay, we're still protesting target. I had a conversation with a friend yesterday who said fuck a target.

Brock Ganeles (04:57.844)
ineffective.

MARK HAYES (05:24.044)
We're still, I'm still, I don't care what Jamal Bryan says, I'm not going in there. And that's largely the sentiment, right? Tabitha Speaks on her All-Star podcast has suggested that we not support anyone supporting the MAGA movement, right? Snoop Dogg has some nerve supporting Donald Trump performing at his event.

And again, it's all self-serving, right? Nobody remembers Snoop Dogg being on trial for murder in 1993, 94. Nobody remembers the image of Snoop Dogg crying in court and covering his face after he was found not guilty. We know he was there. We know who fired the shot. We know who killed the guy.

He had enough money to raise reasonable doubt, got a favorable jury. Otherwise we wouldn't even be talking about Snoop right now. He'd still be locked up. Okay? And now here he is. Here is someone who has been targeted by the system since birth. Right? If you believe the stories about how he grew up in the LBC. Right? And so again, it's self-serving.

What does Snoop get out of it? The Olympics. Snoop's the Olympic coverage culture guy. And what is Snoop there for? To bring in black folks eyeballs to the winter. Black folks ain't going outside in the cold, much less watching something that's happening in the cold. We're not watching that. I'm one of the few black guys that you know that watches hockey. We could probably count them.

113 folks that watch the black folks that watch the gold medal hockey game Right 9 a.m. On a Sunday morning black folks is in church So it's all self-serving Brock and that's what infuriates me little Wayne Right little Wayne was headed to the big house Had to get himself a pardon and he was willing to had the money to pay for it manipulate the system and Now he's a trump

MARK HAYES (07:47.289)
Trump said, okay, I get you to pardon, but this is what you'll do for me. You'll bring the black community to me. You don't care about little Wayne. Probably didn't even know who he was. Nicki Minaj, same thing, got used, right? Needed green cards, you know, some kind of paperwork. Something for her husband who's been accused of being a child predator. That's on brand, isn't it? That's on brand. It's the birds of a feather.

So, you know, it's all self-serving and that's what infuriates us as a community because they're willing to sell out the collective to enrich themselves.

Brock Ganeles (08:29.266)
Why the ire at Chili in particular? Why does she seem to be getting even maybe even more or as much vitriol coming her way?

MARK HAYES (08:41.996)
You know, I would put her right up there with Nicki Minaj. I mean, the cancellation meter is, you know, bouncing back and forth for both of them. I'm not listening to, Nicki Minaj had a couple hits that I really liked. I've taken them out of rotation completely.

And I want to support Tion, T-Boz has been a stalwart in the black community, been a stalwart for autoimmune diseases because she suffers from one, and been a spokesperson for the people. And I want to support her. But the way Jermell Hill framed it, Chile done messed up the church's money.

because their audience is black women. Best selling girl group in the history of R &B. Sold more records than anybody and got ripped off. If you ever saw VH1 behind the music episode about TLC, they told you how you sold 10 million records and each of them made 50 grand. And they sold a whack of records and made $50,000 each. So, you know, we've always had a soft spot for them.

because of that VH1 episode of Behind the Music. And we felt like they were mistreated. And so, I think she's getting the backlash because so many black women supported them for so many years. When Left Eye died, we cried as a community together because it was just a heartfelt loss.

Right? When Left Eye burned down Andre Risen's house, we were sad as a community. Right? We're like, man, can't they get that black love right? Right? We wanted them to win. And so we've been behind them through thick and thin. And we've wanted them, you know, just to be on top. Right? Because we, we've never let go of the fact that they got screwed by the record companies and their management and whoever else took part in ripping them off.

MARK HAYES (11:02.222)
And so I think that is why, and again, their audience is black women and 92 % of black women and 85 % of black men say no to Donald Trump.

Brock Ganeles (11:17.462)
But we get told, hey, the black community is not a monolith, no group is, right? Same we get told in the Latino community, not a monolith, or women, not a monolith, get it? But I'm just trying to understand these high profile black MAGA, you know, let's call them stars and commentary. Why? What are they getting out of it versus

MARK HAYES (11:38.2)
Yeah!

Brock Ganeles (11:46.046)
What are they giving up by playing on that side of the fence? I got like a bad a bad equation

MARK HAYES (11:52.216)
Well...

Brock, we've had short memories, right? We've had very short memories and we've been a very forgiving people. That's what they're banking on. Lil Wayne is banking that, you know, the hood is gonna still represent him when his next project comes out. know, Nicki Minaj, same thing.

You know, Chilly, I don't know what she's banking on. Because, you know, it's girl power when you talk about TLC and their audience. You know, it's not hip hop. Right? So it's a different genre of music and a different demographic that supports her. So I don't know, you know, what she thinks she was getting out of supporting Donald Trump. Who was

Attimately going after black women now they now they're doing it wide open Pete Hegseth We're not promoting blacks and and and and black women We ain't doing it first chance we get we firing you out of here We white nationalists. They're saying it Right. They're saying the quiet part out loud now

Brock Ganeles (13:14.282)
The question I always want to ask is what policy or policies do you support? Explain it to me.

MARK HAYES (13:22.894)
They can't beyond the surface level Snoop can't tell you anymore About what Donald Trump is doing besides what he got paid that night To perform at the inauguration. You saw he was up there by himself. He was DJing and hit and emceeing Probably couldn't get anybody to go with I'm just saying I don't know. I don't know snoops friend group

But I'm just saying, Snoop can't tell you, I guarantee you Snoop can't tell you what Donald Trump's policies are. I guarantee you he can't tell what the impact of the shutdown of USAID was on people of color on that continent from where we came. He can't tell you how many people have died because USAID was shut down.

Brock Ganeles (14:21.014)
Mm-hmm.

MARK HAYES (14:21.958)
But it's in the millions, we know that. We know there are tens of millions of people going hungry because of what we've stopped doing in the last 16 months. Snoop doesn't know about that, because it's not in his wheelhouse. He's not reading about that. Ice Cube, from his so-called agenda for black folks,

seem to be all about tax cuts for the wealthy. That's where he seems to be living.

Right? And look, Ice Cube went from, you know, fuck the police to are we there yet? Right? You look at his movies, right? That's a wholesome family movie that white America might enjoy. Well, I let, let's, hey honey, let's take the kids and go see it. That's a terrible white guy impression, but.

I mean, fuck, you know, what are you doing, Q? Like we can see, we see you. We see you, bro. And so, you know, it's a self-serving, self-preservation mentality. And we've had it from the very beginning, from the people who were saying, hey, you know, come on over here. You get on this boat right here.

And you know, what's the running joke in the black community? You know that the the the the black slave traders there's free chicken on the boat Right the old trope the black people love fried chicken. You can get you some free fried chicken on the slave ship You know and a free ticket to America to work for free So it's all it's all about self-preservation the black slave traders were in it for themselves That's where it came from

MARK HAYES (16:24.244)
And now, you know, with black, I mean, think about it, brah. We have 1 17th the wealth of the average white, 1 17th. The average family in Boston, black family, Metro Boston worth $8. You can't get a dozen donuts at Dunkin Donuts for $8. Black America has been hurting. Black America gets successful.

And then all of a sudden there are these falls from grace. It happens all the time, right? Trying to achieve this proximity to white America. That's why we say there needs to be a reckoning on race. We shouldn't have to compromise our morals and beliefs in order to be closer to the white American dream in order to access it ourselves. But yet we still think that.

And that's the sad part. Code switching is the big thing now, right? Talking like a rapper when you're with your friends and the homies. And then when you get in corporate America, you kind of sound like I do. Jim, I like that idea a lot. Why don't we run with it? So the code switching thing, right? We got to fit in. Why do we have to fit in? We got different cultures. Nobody's asking you to act.

differently as a Jewish man Right Yeah, you're accepted in a lot of circles, right? You're you're put how many black banks are there Brock? I? Mean we can count them We can count we got a couple here in Atlanta, but Atlanta is the black Mecca Right. It's kind of like being in DC. There are Brock when I was on television

As a television news anchor, used to have these conversations with my white female agent. Hey, Mark, we need to focus on these cities where they're willing to hire African-American men with a dark complexion.

MARK HAYES (18:37.442)
Who am I? We used to have to focus on those cities.

And I made the terrible mistake of going to Dallas thinking that I could be successful. And I got to Dallas and looked around and said, my goodness, I'm the only one. I didn't even last the full three year contract. And I was blown out. Metro Dallas wouldn't watch me. So, you know, it's all self-serving.

They're not gonna be able to explain to you what kind of policies they support.

Brock Ganeles (19:17.974)
Well, let me ask you this. Do these incidents, you know, let's call them incidents, which have increased in the last three, four months, are they galvanizing and energizing the black community in their insurgency or resistance against Trump? Or is it chipping away at the solidarity?

MARK HAYES (19:29.132)
Yeah.

Brock Ganeles (19:44.98)
because when high profile black people say they're MAGA, it maybe gives more black people license to be MAGA or they get MAGA curious. Has it been a positive or a negative?

MARK HAYES (19:59.279)
I think black people are done with Trump, have been done with Trump ever since Trump 1.0. We knew how he felt. We took him at his word. You know, what am I, Angelou, saying when somebody shows you who they are, believe them. We believe who Donald Trump says he is. He is. You and I grew up in Metro New York, Brock. We know who Donald Trump is.

We knew he was a buffoon when we realized he couldn't make money at a casino, a place where people give you money and expect absolutely nothing in return. They don't care if you give them a watered down drink in the casino.

Brock Ganeles (20:33.59)
He was just he was just Harmless back then because he had no power, know He was just he was a cartoon character in the news and he had a lot of money So he was gonna get to run around in social circles and do stupid shit like take ads out against the Central Park five But he had no in no real maybe I didn't once behind the scenes because the money But he had no power. He was he couldn't really impact other people's lives

MARK HAYES (20:39.68)
Yes. Right.

MARK HAYES (20:47.32)
Right.

MARK HAYES (20:56.642)
Right. Right.

Right. And think about it, Brock. Central Park Five are grown men now. And they're telling their story every chance they get. Yusuf Hawkins is a representative, US representative in New York now. Santana Raymond ran for office. He used to be here in Atlanta, moved back to New York recently. Those men are still traumatized from what happened to them for a crime they didn't commit. Yeah, they were teens.

Brock Ganeles (21:26.26)
Yeah, fuck yeah, they were young. They thought they were gonna get killed or thrown away forever. Yeah, they saw themselves getting railroaded and you know that murder being or that rape being hung on them. They they envisioned themselves in Rikers for fucking their entire lives.

MARK HAYES (21:31.735)
Yes!

MARK HAYES (21:43.342)
and the white contingent in prison brutalized them. They were lucky to make it out alive. In all the years that they spent, all those years.

Brock Ganeles (21:54.103)
That way, prosecutors are guilty. He still, she still, she still won't let go. She can't her mind. She can't have any learning curve. She can't come to any realization with new facts. Even later on just shows how. Yeah.

MARK HAYES (22:01.207)
Right!

Right.

MARK HAYES (22:09.962)
even when the guy admitted to it. Even when the guy who did it admitted to it. So

Brock Ganeles (22:14.448)
So is the black community getting more... I mean it sounds very white guys to say more activists right now. Are the rumblings increasing? No. You're just telling people... There's just a sense when people pop up with some pro-Maggaleenings the... let's call it what used to be called black Twitter, black blue sky is...

MARK HAYES (22:26.54)
No. Not that I've heard. Not that I've heard.

Brock Ganeles (22:43.496)
is slapping them down quickly and telling them, but now everyone's thinking economic and saying, okay, we're gonna, we're gonna boycott you. We're gonna starve your, you're not making your money off of us.

MARK HAYES (22:55.786)
Right. And that's where we are. I say, I saw a meme yesterday, was Kendrick Lamar dancing and behind him was a burning city. And the caption said, everyone else in the US. my God, I can't believe where we are as a country. Black folks, minding our business, because we done told y'all. And Kendrick Lamar dancing around. Funny meme, got 20,000 likes immediately.

We said, look, we can't help you. We're not gonna go out here and die, right, to try to fix a white supremacist problem. We've been under the thumb of white supremacy for 400 years. We can't fix it for you. We're 14 % of the population. White America's 51 % of the population and shrinking. And that's the issue.

Right? We've heard it. How many times have we heard it? Why do you think, you know, we can't have abort, they don't want women, white women especially having abortions. It's a numbers game. It's a numbers game. If you don't believe me, ask Jane Elliott. Google Jane Elliott on YouTube. She will explain to you what the anti-abortion sentiment is all about in white America. It's a numbers game. It's the browning of America that scares the living shit out of white people.

Brock Ganeles (24:04.416)
Moving numbers.

MARK HAYES (24:23.756)
And you know what, white people, for those of you watching today and listening, or if you're within the sound of my voice.

We're not thinking about trying to get back at you. We're not trying to enslave you. We're not trying to put you in bondage. We're not trying to hurt you. We want the same things you want for your family. We want good schools, nice, clean, safe neighborhood, nice streets, safe and clean.

and great opportunities for our children. We wanna be able to travel freely. We want justice, right? We wanna be treated fairly. We wanna be able to work in a place where we can stay and grow. Brock, do you know how many of my colleagues that I watched, right? Move up in the ranks at the stations that they were hired by.

And I had to move Albany, Georgia, Rochester, New York, Denver, Colorado, Baltimore, Maryland, Detroit, Atlanta, Dallas. I had to move, move, move, move, move for opportunity after, meanwhile I'm watching. So you know what that means? I didn't get a chance to acquire the same kind of wealth as the people who were able to sit in a home for 20 years, 25 years, acquire a pension.

You know, if I had a crystal ball, I probably could have figured out which city to stay in, but I didn't have one. Right? And if you know where they're selling them, black folks would love to know. But we want the same things that white America wants, And that's the bottom line. And we're not thinking about retribution and getting back at white America.

Brock Ganeles (26:25.878)
Why do think there hasn't been a or a few galvanizing voices in the black community Latino community right now like really You know coalescing the group into to make it a stronger faction and to wield more power or Has it happened and I'm just in my white silo and I'm not and I'm not seeing it

MARK HAYES (26:55.638)
Brock, it's hard to galvanize a segmented audience. We're all in different places and trying to get the attention of everyone in, ask any politician. How do I get everyone's You can't get everyone's attention. Some are on Facebook, some are on the gram, some are on Snap, some are on the dark web.

Right, like people are all over the TikTok. Right, you don't, where do you go? Right, you can get this piece of your audience, 18 to 34, but where are the leaders that are emerging? Right, the Tennessee three, you could talk about them. Right, Justin Pearson, you can get the 18 to 34 crowd, but what about the Facebook crowd? It's me and you, that's older.

Right? It skews older. I just think it is so difficult for one voice to resonate in so many different places that it's hard to galvanize even like-minded people. So I think that's a problem for white America too. You know, but it seems to have been very effective for what? At least 35%.

of the white population who support MAGA, they're all in the same silo. And so, like Blue Sky, I'm trying to think if I, my fraternity brothers, my colleagues are on Blue Sky. Yeah, still on Twitter. I mean, what say you on that? Cause I just think it's a hard,

Brock Ganeles (28:42.282)
Mm-hmm. on Twitter.

Brock Ganeles (28:47.83)
Ugh.

Brock Ganeles (28:54.76)
It's very hard to do. mean, is that something maybe Jasmine Crockett will do after she loses her seat and I mean has to give up her seat, you know, and just becomes like a pundit and or a leader, you know, it's almost like we used to laugh, you know, they used to try to disparage Obama as a community organizer. And yet that's what we need. We need community organizers right now. Yeah. And it can't be one person and there's a lot of

MARK HAYES (28:55.029)
A hard lift, a heavy lift!

MARK HAYES (29:03.436)
Why possibly?

MARK HAYES (29:09.313)
Right?

MARK HAYES (29:18.988)
Right?

Brock Ganeles (29:23.766)
There's a of people getting big audiences independently on social media. Like, you know, there are voices, right? DLHueley is getting a big audience. You know, he says something, I hear about it, right? It makes it through to me.

MARK HAYES (29:28.268)
Bye.

MARK HAYES (29:37.238)
Right.

Brock Ganeles (29:41.537)
By the way, Justin Pearson in Tennessee or one of the two guys in Tennessee is in a, is going to be in a really tough primary coming up because he's gone against Steve Cohen is like a 75 year old congressman who wouldn't step aside. I do agree. Magga is splintering, but Magga maybe was brought together by all those from Tucker Carlson or maybe Fox news brings it together. But then there's Tucker Carlson and there was, there was Charlie Kirk.

MARK HAYES (29:48.696)
Right?

MARK HAYES (29:54.07)
I saw that.

MARK HAYES (30:03.917)
Right.

Brock Ganeles (30:08.648)
and there were these other podcasts Ben Shapiro's these this podcast universe that also ran parallel to Fox News and brought them all together. But maybe there's such one issue. One issue people that it's easy for them to get together because it's their whiteness that just brings them together. And it's just yeah, it's just an easy connectivity versus things fighting for democracy.

MARK HAYES (30:14.882)
Right.

MARK HAYES (30:21.559)
and

MARK HAYES (30:25.236)
Exactly. Exactly. It was all about the whiteness.

And remember what we

Brock Ganeles (30:36.596)
And equality is a much more intangible. Yeah.

MARK HAYES (30:39.446)
It's a broad yes. And remember Brock, we talked about this at the outset of the show. One of the things that we wanted to focus on was a consistent message from the left, right? And just as you mentioned right there, you know, the right, the white right had one message, right? Save white America, right? And they all echoed it in all their different, you know, media outlets.

Brock Ganeles (31:09.738)
The disappointing thing also on the left and in white America is is how aggressively so many really old white people want to hang on to their power and influence. know, and I view Chuck Schumer as like the poster child for that. Like not having read the room to say, you know what, it's time for me to step aside and a younger voice needs to step in here.

MARK HAYES (31:29.037)
Yeah.

.

Brock Ganeles (31:38.451)
a different voice, a younger voice, more in touch with where, you know, the country's going at this point in time, whatever the message is. And the fact that that Steve Cohen in Tennessee is still fighting to keep his congressional seat in his mid seventies versus the young 30 year old up and comer black guy. But he still, he just wants to hold on to his little touch of power because he thinks he's effective, right? I'm sure he's convinced himself in his mind that he needs to be in that seat because he's so important.

And there just hasn't been the passing of the torch and that has, it's watered down the energy.

MARK HAYES (32:16.244)
and slowed us down considerably. To a crawl.

Brock Ganeles (32:18.39)
slow to slow because you can be led by 70 year old Chuck Schumer. How fast are you going to run when he's at the front of the pack? Right. So we all got to like stuff one place behind him trying to go as slow as he has when really the rank and file or, you know, are sprinting past them. But like you said, it's hard to community organize. That's why I do commend the no Kings indivisible. Like those organizations have done a great job. They're not.

MARK HAYES (32:37.143)
Right.

MARK HAYES (32:46.913)
Right.

Brock Ganeles (32:48.882)
expressing enough anger for my taste.

MARK HAYES (32:52.48)
Right I got you Yeah, yeah Brock before we get out of here, let's get a quick hit. I have a question for you and my quick hit Gino are Emma attack Or rightful criticism of dawn staley dawn was gracious last year in the national championship when she lost the yukon but Gino had a little

Brock Ganeles (32:54.058)
but they're doing a good job of community organizing.

MARK HAYES (33:21.292)
little fire in him last night when he went after her after the game. I mean it wasn't a close game. What'd you make of that?

Brock Ganeles (33:28.648)
It was a funny, it's funny. Just as the last comment I was making about Schumer and, and I'm not saying, you know, or am asked to step aside. He's just one of the best coaches still in the country. He has a great program, won it last year, but it was like old white guy entitlement. Like, wow, he got slighted. I mean, you couldn't really say, why is the race in sports? And you don't want it to be there, but it's like, he, you know,

MARK HAYES (33:35.214)
to

MARK HAYES (33:42.305)
Yeah.

MARK HAYES (33:51.116)
Right.

Brock Ganeles (33:55.095)
He was slighted by the not younger younger than him black coach because he didn't think she was doing things by the standard that he thought was the right way of doing things in the pregame. No one even knows talking about it's not about him anyway. You're just the coaches, the players, your grudge. It was just like it was very Trumpian like an old baby complaining about the refs.

MARK HAYES (34:00.119)
Right.

MARK HAYES (34:18.754)
Yes.

Brock Ganeles (34:21.862)
in the interview and then after the game storming off not shaking hands I can only call it absolutely bush league and he was frustrated that he got out coached which he did if you watch the game he got out coached they took away his two top guns with a great game plan he couldn't figure out he couldn't push the right buttons he couldn't figure out anything to get anything to work and he got beat on a big stage but you know what

MARK HAYES (34:34.092)
Yeah. Yeah.

Brock Ganeles (34:51.598)
He's won fucking 15 times. He can't be gracious in defeat. You're gonna win some you're gonna lose some it's that's the game You don't win every time so in the end I think was I'll just sum it up I think was an epic fail of sportsmanship on Geno's part

MARK HAYES (34:55.437)
You would think.

All right.

MARK HAYES (35:07.862)
Let me move past Gino because I agree with you there. And I caught myself last night watching Madison Booker and, gosh, number three, can't remember her last name, I think was Raymond. Yes, yes, the little point guard, number three. And I caught myself, stereotyping Coach Schaeffer.

Brock Ganeles (35:25.908)
Like Rory something the point guard I think yeah

MARK HAYES (35:38.145)
All night, all night. I was just like, how's this old white dude coaching these young fiery black women and they're out there busting their ass and they're, Jesus, nothing's good enough for him. And then I had to smack myself and say, my God, I love this guy. When he embraced,

Raymond when she came off the court at the end of the game. She was in tears He spoke to her as if like he was you know one of her uncles and he embraced her and he talked to her and she nodded in agreement and then he hugged her and we saw it at the end of the game and I was like fuck I love this guy. I was totally wrong about him and He could coach my daughter if I had one

Maybe my granddaughter go play for him. I loved it.

Brock Ganeles (36:36.822)
Well, then she knows a great coach and the players love him and the interviews, the Yukon players, as he fudge interview is so great, like just about feeling she's let the team down. But the experience she had over what ended up being five years because of her injuries was just, she couldn't even barely put into words how great an experience that she had had, right? And she knows at the head of that program. So it's nothing about that. It's, it's just like what he did wasn't good for the game. You know, do what's right for the game.

MARK HAYES (36:55.554)
Yeah.

MARK HAYES (37:03.478)
Right. And we're trying to grow the game.

Brock Ganeles (37:06.922)
Be an example, show sportsmanship, take you in a fucking lot. And a lot of coaches have had to come over and shake your hand in moments that were horrendous for them. Be above it. Respect the game, respect the players and stop making it about you. And think about the future of the game that you're trying to build women's sports and you're a key part of that. And like in that moment,

MARK HAYES (37:18.776)
Right.

MARK HAYES (37:22.637)
Be better.

MARK HAYES (37:26.85)
Right.

Brock Ganeles (37:36.735)
like just be better. Yeah, I think it was it was a disappointment. I think it hurts him. And now there's a hashtag going around that Lisa Leslie started, which is Gino apologize. And he really should in the light of day, the next day, he should apologize and put it to bed, put apologize, wish South Carolina good luck in the final and say that he lost his school and move on from it. And if he does it, he'll look even more Bush league. If he tries to hold on to something.

MARK HAYES (38:01.121)
Yeah, look even worse. Yep, absolutely. All right, bro. by the way, the most stylish coach in college basketball, Sid Carter on the Texas sideline. Gosh, she's a great follow on on Instagram too. Great, great. Insane, insane. She's got like a few million followers.

Brock Ganeles (38:18.806)
All right. I'm going to follow her. I'm a huge women's basketball fan, right? I'll watch any basketball. I love all basketball and I like the women's game. If there's more ball movement, yeah. Both those games were sloppy yesterday though and low scoring and kind of shitty and everyone, it's kind of like almost all the stars played lousy yesterday, which is disappointing, but it happens, Yeah, she was all right.

MARK HAYES (38:31.746)
Games grow.

MARK HAYES (38:36.141)
Yeah.

MARK HAYES (38:41.388)
Yeah, yeah. Lauren Betts had a game though for UCLA. She had a game.

Brock Ganeles (38:48.67)
She only took 11 shots, but.

You know, mean the better team won simple as that and we'll go further. It's like look, it shouldn't be such a big surprise. South Carolina plays in a harder conference. They played more tough games. They were more battle tested. You can almost hurt by the fact that their league is so weak that they cruise through. That wasn't an undefeated team. You can't. They're not that good, but they had, know, they beat their one games early and then it was too easy for them. And South Carolina has a slugfest down there in the South.

MARK HAYES (38:54.092)
Yeah.

MARK HAYES (39:08.054)
Right.

Right. Right.

MARK HAYES (39:20.406)
Yeah, man. All right, buddy.

Brock Ganeles (39:21.614)
What do we say inside the military? We're not safe. No, we're not safe. And by the way, unless it happened while we were doing this podcast, we still have not found that missing airman in Iran. Let us only hope he's still alive. I think it's a he, but I guess I don't that mean

MARK HAYES (39:25.696)
Not at all.

MARK HAYES (39:32.142)
I'm missing airman. Yep. That ain't good.

Yeah, we gotta pray for... Yeah, we gotta pray for that officer. All right, buddy, we'll rack it up and do it again. Happy Easter, happy Passover, all that. Revolution. Revolution.

Brock Ganeles (39:43.382)
All right. Always a pleasure. Talk to you tomorrow. Thank you. Talk to you tomorrow.